This month in the private feed, we’ve STILL been talking about dating in dystopia. This time, taking a look at the gendered challenges of dating online, through peer-reviewed research.
We first had an episode centralized around the lack of information and therefore expertise of men navigating the apps. Discussing the common shame and self-disparagement experiences that lead to disparaging others for self-protection – i.e. “she’s not good enough for ME” or having high appearance standards to write off as many women as possible – as a defensive measure after experiencing the same. Matching can be addictive and ego-determining when apps are the major source of socializing, making every interaction or lack thereof highly impactful on emotions. We also talked about the bouts of aggression that sometimes spring up after perceived rejection or awkwardness, when then sitting alone in deep seas of uncomfortable feelings that no one has taught these men to handle… as in, lashing out at a match when a conversation or date doesn’t go ideally as a way to offload bad energies. And we talked about how blocking fits into these self-defense strategies. When you don’t know what to say or how to proceed, cutting off communication is one way to avoid more shame. At least it feels like it was your choice. With this information, we aimed at finding compassion for the men who don’t have the tools they need to date and DO have human minds that turn against themselves, resulting in maladaptive behaviors to cope and find comfort.
Then we spoke about… sortof the opposite. Women’s challenges on the apps… in the form of the advice doled out to them by other women. Rather than having no progressive dating information, perhaps this gender has TOO MUCH. We dove into a research article on the capitalistic drives behind advice instagrams and the resulting information that’s spit out to maintain followers and sponsors. Finding that the advisement we’ve been receiving may not be helpful or based in reality or coherent over time, so much as it’s selling attractive stories to overburdened and terrified women. For example… “red flags” – do they have utility or are they snappy flashes of information removed from context and the definition of “covert abuse”? If they’re red flags in MY dating history, are they red flags in the context of YOUR patterns? Probably not, because they’re based on MY unhealed wounds being re-played out in modern reality – not yours. And if it’s covert, why are we expecting ourselves to be able to detect and avoid the abuse? The whole point is that it builds and it’s personalized, so we cannot see it clearly. Answer: because we also discussed the unfair over-responsibility placed on women’s shoulders now that abuse information is so widely spread. Since (maybe too much) information IS available, we now expect ourselves and others to be relationship masters. To make zero mistakes. Which has the boomerang effect of shutting women down from dating attempts when the pressure is too great and any negative experiences are seen as personal failures. AKA -dating isn’t fun anymore now that we’re all expected to be psychological profilers and online FBI agents.
THEN we dipped out of the stereotypical, heteronormative, dating experience and covered two articles on transgendered and non-binary app exchanges. Their problem? Perhaps being in the intersection of the lacking and the overabundant misinformation on the internet, depending on how they identify and who they’re attracted to. Will you be rejected because they don’t know enough or because they think they know everything? Hard to say, but only 1-3% of cis hetero individuals state that they would be open to sexual or romantic relationships with the TNB crowd, between both men AND women. Indicating that something is probably awry in our educations and applications of supposedly “woke epidemic” info. Also, research revealed that dating isn’t a more comforting and communal experience for transgendered individuals the way that it often is for the Ls and Gs. Transgendered persons are still (often) having to swim in the ocean of the general population when swiping, therefore facing the same stigmatization and fetishization in their romantic attempts as when walking down the street. And apps aren’t (usually) built for their accurate gender expression, causing them to “misrepresent” themselves no matter what they do. Putting them at risk of running into (see aforementioned shame-based anger) bigots, being asked intrusive questions, and having to educate others instead of getting to know them. And, having to worry about their safety, when, say, public outing is very possible and geolocation sharing is too precise for comfort. It was an eye-opening episode on the “danger everywhere” experience of the T and NB communities, who bump up against the propagandized and poorly educated with every step they take simply through trying to be authentic to themselves. Luckily, we ended on a high note about the positive relationship rewards after the risks that these brave and self-aware souls endure. A nice in-breath and a reminder that we all could learn to be more tenacious in our romantic quests.
And in between? We had bonus episodes discussing more conversational and experiential reflections on these topics. Since I don’t want to get sued for sharing research… that’s what I have for you today!
Honestly, I fear the men-compassionate episodes may be too controversial to throw into the abyssnet. Including a discussion on whether or not the “consent generation” has been doing any of us any favors… or just creating the illusion of consent. Yeah, it’s something for the open-minded to chew on.
So this is the Bonus episode on the challenges faced by women in dating… which are unlike the ones we normally hear about online. Does feminism help? How about all that information? And, of course, what about the continually, artificially, elevated appearance and mothering expectations?
Let’s hop in. And I’ll talk to you next month, unless I see you sooner in the research episode stream Patreon.com/traumatizedmotherfuckers where we’ll be talking about the crossover between physical responses to historical trauma and likelihood of future victimization this month.
How do our walks, postures, and voices help predators pinpoint us? And how might this relate to troubles in dating “the wrong type”?
Join up, jump into the research with us, and find out.
Til then, stay safe out there, however you identify.
Enjoy this casual episode.
And cheers.
Poor girls
Ladyyyyys. You know what night it is.
We wouldn’t put out a bonus on boy compassion without another for ya girls.
You know the deal. “is our modern, tech-driven, psychoeducational, dystopian world helping or hurting?” And in what ways, to which (stereotypical) demographics?
Let’s go.
The first and greatest problem?
The “should” be able to investigate / sniff out a predator expectation
Yeah, we just talked about it. And I don’t think that was sufficient for how large a problem it’s become.
Because we have information online and in therapy about common toxic traits, we’re now supposed to be masters of this knowledge.
Meanwhile, with the people we’re trying to avoid also learning what their indicators might be.
Let’s call it an educational arms race. And realize that it’s gone beyond punch-punch bang-bang nuclear aggression.
Societally we’ve gone from “abuse means physical violence – if you’re not getting hit, what are you complaining about” to “abuse comes in all forms, most of them undetectable to be most effective in their ability to control and confuse.”
And yet… we’re still expected to bypass this fact. The nature of emotional, mental, financial, and other forms of abuse, which is “masked, built into the relationship over time, and impossible to look at directly.”
Somehow, despite learning that, we’re supposed to read into the depths of people’s emotional issues. To notice what dark shadows might be lurking that we cannot see. To take action, immediately and confidently, once they’re detected.
With all of that being impossible.
So that dating has become a continual test of our learning and desire for a better life, with very low emotional returns, high suspicion / paranoia, mental battles about what is and isn’t correct, and many tests of one’s willpower.
For naught.
Because in most cases, we will still fail to identify what’s happening beneath the strategic, carefully crafted, surface level presentation.
Because in most cases, we are not trained psychotherapists.
So that after all our efforts to notice and name what we’re observing in a potential dating partner… if they’re any good at it at all… we still lose. We still end up in the relationship we’re trying to avoid with great strain.
Which has the effect of shutting a bitch down, when the stress of avoiding the dangers starts to feel like a danger, itself. In great part because of the self-scrutiny and abuse that comes in the wake of accidentally bumping up against abuse from others when we “should know better.”
Dating is not fun anymore! It’s framed like a game of cat and mouse. And it feels similarly survival-challenging. Very stark. Cold. Overly responsible. Overly critical, onto ourselves, the ladies.
Because there’s now such judgment on modern, empowered, women if they dare to let their hearts make a mistake. Or, two judgments, at least:
- They shouldn’t need a man
- They’re idiots if they let the wrong one in
1) Somehow, we’re supposed to have less needs than ever before. Nah, we don’t need love, companionship, mutuality, intimate relationship anymore. Because we can earn our own paychecks, we’re no longer biological humans with the same brain necessities as the past 40,000 years of evolution.
And 2) if we DO let our needs inspire us to connect with someone… we then have the sole responsibility of making sure that person is “a good one.” Or else WE’RE the assholes for putting ourselves in a compromised position when we should have known better and shouldn’t have needed this relationship in the first place.
So, together, we’re accused of (and accuse ourselves of) welcoming a completely unnecessary source of suffering into our lives. For being too weak to resist all men, forever. For having feelings. For being easily misled. For having “bad pickers.” For not learning from instagram fast enough.
Rather than, you know, assessing that we have basic emotional and physical needs and instincts on top of a sea of confused, demasculinized, shameful options in a world in transition.
These ridiculous, blaming, standards make it impossible to feel confident or supported in your quest for relationship. And it makes a person not want to try.
Hey, for literally 5 years, I didn’t, for these reasons.
“I know too much to bite into another shit sandwich.”
And yet… applying that information leads to only disappointment and discouragement. Because there are no healthy-appearing options (possible). Or because I’m expecting too much from myself, using flawed information, together, both of which are now holding me back from giving anything a try (likely).
Next problem women are facing:
Teach me to date me
Let’s also mention that the psychoeducation seems to be rather gendered in a lot of cases.
Are straight cis men doing the same legwork that women are now expected to? No! That’s why we have the extra burden of trying to diagnose and avoid monsters (worst case scenario) and to manage everyone if we ARE in a relationship (best case scenario).
So, relationships, for us can tend to look a lot like a teacher-student scenario rather than two equals meeting with shared knowledge and goals.
It’s exhausting. It’s stressful. It’s unsexy.
It’s not enough that we’ve had to historically step in as their new mothers – teaching them how to dress, give compliments, and pitch in around the house or with errands…. But now we’re also tagged in as their personal therapist and life coach, on top of it.
It’s like having an extra job, within the job of having a relationship. Relationships are work, but some of us get stuck pulling double or triple duty to make up for the lack of expertise of our colleague.
So even if we do identify a non-abusive relationship partner, that doesn’t mean they carry their weight. And we might have to integrate, apply, and educate with the information we’ve been collecting on the internet to try to get them up to speed.
Which is extra effort, in the hopes of eventual positive returns.
Which sortof sells your brain to the other individual. You have the sunk cost fallacy to contend with. No one wants to put in the elbow grease of helping another person to evolve… only for them to run off and share the spoils of your efforts with some OTHER bitch, if it doesn’t work out.
Meaning we can get locked into a helpless, hopeless, romantic situation in which we have nothing left to give but also can’t convince ourselves to stop trying. The relationship becomes colored by resentment, frustration, and inequity.
And, ironically, at that point, for all the psychological knowledge and avoidance of abusers that one may have successfully navigated… abuse is likely to pop up in the relationship, anyways.
Something to be on the lookout for. Don’t take on another job, costumed as a boyfriend.
Which is hard, because most boyfriend candidates aren’t doing the job themselves. But after potentially several years of relationship avoidance and needs deprivation, a lady’s gotta get romantic with someone.
So, she might sell herself into a guest lecturer position, which unfortunately becomes tenured with time.
And speaking of time… let’s say that recent ones haven’t been particularly kind to us.
Appearance pressures; anti-aging, IG face, grande anorexia
Let’s discuss it… appearance standards have gotten crazy.
Or, the potential for self-comparison which raises appearance standards to insane heights… has gotten crazy.
There’s a “look” that swept the internet years ago. The botox, filler, tattooed eyebrows, lash extension, alien-face, big booty, A4 paper waist vibe.
The “impossible to live up to unless it is literally your job” trend.
And then add in all the photo filters, so it seems ubiquitous that everyone is achieving this degree of perfection, while it is not.
Are men falling for these carefully curated, sometimes computer-generated appearance standards? Do they think this is what normal women look like nowadays? Is this what they’re expecting of us?
It kindof doesn’t matter, because many of us are expecting it from ourselves. Which, again, contributes to withdrawing from the dating game entirely when one judges themselves as missing the mark or being unable to keep up with the Kardashians. Or, at the very least, a much more stressful and self-harassing dating experience.
If you’re determined to have appearance perfection, you might plan all your dates around the efforts it takes to nip, tuck, cinch, and suck in all the problems. You might feel very limited in finding a day that works. You might find that life is an oppositional force to dating, because the responsibilities and stresses of keeping yourself afloat break or prohibit appearance perfection behaviors… so that dating feels impossible unless you’re doing it on vacation.
For instance:
Emotional and stress eating, a problem that I have when life is hard. It makes me get a little belly – goodbye “snatched” waistline in a matter of 2 days. It makes my skin bumpy – forget that glass skin goalpost. It makes me sleep less – don’t even pretend we’re going to be bright-eyed like anime standards suggest.
And when these things happen, I don’t want to bother to meet anyone. Because my real persondom is showing. Whereas the internet would have us believe that every one of us is a magazine model.
The unfortunate news is, appearance ebbs and flows for a lot of us. We can’t expect ourselves not to reflect the challenges we’re going through or the ways we’re coping. We are whole animals, absorbing and responding to it all.
But we do expect those things, anyways.
Because the internet – our number one source of peers – convinces us that it’s normal, appropriate, and “correct,” if we did.
And if we don’t?
We’re convinced that OTHERS are judging us this way. So we’ll only ever be disappointing with our “less than” offerings. So why bother trying?
And if we DO bother trying?
We might feel unworthy. We might be paranoid that our partner could do better or wants to do better. We might mistakenly take unsuccessful dates or relationship endings as indicators of our physical shortcomings. We might decide to go get pumped full of cosmetic juices before we feel like we’re capable of dating. The process and cost of which, are date making deterrents and dating pool limiters.
So as a lady who is, admittedly, vane and concerned about feeling attractive to my partner, let me say…
You’re not the only one if you’ve been convinced that something societally happened around 2015 that made everyone a supermodel except for yourself. Or the standards of appearance suddenly skyrocketed without warning.
And you’re not alone if that has impacted your self-confidence in finding the right partner.
But you may have also noticed this, whittling down the options for who could possibly be that person:
Unambitious or hustlers?
I’m not sure if I’m the only one who’s seen this – I’m guessing not.
With the death of the middle class has come the death of middle-of-the-road, well-balanced, work-life equitable, men.
On the dating market, men seem to fall into two categories:
- Those who, as we’ve said recently, are floundering. Lying flat due to the pressures of the world, the limited opportunities, and the rapidly changing expectations on their heads. The men being crushed by dystopia who’ve forgone ambition in the face of insurmountable challenge, and seem to be slowly pissing their lives away.
- Those who are swimming faster and more powerfully than ever. The hustle-culture boys. The guys who’ve, largely, had a leg-up, which has spared them from the crushing experience described above, and instead convinced them that maxxing in every area of life is the way to keep earning Ws. The men who are slam-dunking professionally and economically while the rest of society can barely dribble. Again, largely due to their familial benefits that pushed them into the right places at the right times, with the right business contacts.
One group? Suffering in general. And suffering from low esteem as a result. Good luck getting them to meaningfully engage or treat you respectfully while their shame breaks their knees. Assuming they can afford to date – which is questionable – they are likely to self-sabotage whatever good thing might start to take root to keep the relationship in line with their overarching life experience and self-perception. You might hear a lot of “you’re too good for me, you deserve better,” self-hating sob stories that serve as justification for absentee or abusive behaviors. You might also find yourself feeling like a sugar mama – perhaps with a grown man trying to attach himself to your teat, as a means of self-support. A switchup of traditional gender roles, as the dude assesses himself unable to meet the old, stereotypical, “manly” expectations in so many ways.
The other group? Floats above the rest of us on a flying carpet, riding the winds of borderline-grandiose self-esteem, as they compare themselves to everyone down below. Again, good luck getting a date or the communication that one would expect to follow; these dudes have a gym-work-laundry-family time schedule that’s jam-packed every minute of every day… or they’re unwilling to collect those extra minutes together to give them to you. These guys are so regimented and full of their own perceived successes, it’s a challenge to meet, meet consistently, or converse on a human level when you do.
The layers-down, for me, tend to have a more similar life experience, background, and set of philosophies. But a mismatching current approach to life. A huge disparity in our senses of responsibility and go-gettum-ship. While I can’t get them out of bed, I’ve been awake and working for 12 hours. A setup for disappointment and resentment.
The high-fliers, for me, tend to have discrepant life experiences, backgrounds, and belief systems… but a more similar approach to life. Unfortunately, coming from different motivations. While they operate from a “do-control-succeed, because it is my right” mentality, I’m coming from a “do it all–have no control-hopefully survive, because I’ve overworked myself to check all the boxes” perspective.
And either way, we’re not seeing eye to eye. We’re not approaching life the same way. It’s like we live in different worlds.
Falling into the chasm between extreme under- and over-doers; another current challenge for women trying to date in this extreme economy and societal situation.
And finally:
Feminism – for whom?
We touched on this in our last full episode: feminism has taken many forms in the last 50 years. Some of them popularized and utilized by the internet for content creation. Some of them common to the cultural experience, implicitly.
And… controversial question… have any of them helped us?
The post-feminism tied to consumerism and Instagram – the “#softgirl” “#stayathomegirlfriend” trends… I think most of us would say… have not. They’ve been returns to womanly helplessness and underselling ourselves, in my opinion. In many ways taking advantage of men not feeling as though they’re allowed to be stereotypical men, by saying “okay, man up for me by paying all the bills – does that make you feel stronger?” These post-feminism calls to inaction have been a return to the old narratives about traditional gender roles and what each person is expected or equipped to do, which are only empowering in their ability to encourage line-drawing for women. “Not my job, I worry about the dishes not the finances, you carry some burden.” Which is not helpful when, say, the woman needs her own finances rather than dish gloves.
And the traditional feminism linked with women acquiring more rights, roles, and responsibilities, so they can function in society without requiring a man… well…
I hate to say, I also don’t believe has done us many favors long-term.
Yes, it’s incredible that we can be independent. We can work. We can be CEOs and high earners, too. We don’t have to live with mom and dad until some man comes along and purchases us. We don’t have to stay in abusive or neglectful partnerships. It’s a big improvement in women’s rights and I appreciate all those who bravely put on their pants to make it happen - don’t get me wrong.
And also.
Feminism hasn’t made feminine energy more acceptable or appreciated in society at large. It hasn’t broadly moved our culture closer to seeking or promoting stereotypical female qualities, perspectives, or aspects to life.
It HAS made women act more like men in that culture.
So that we’re expected to be BOTH women – keepers of the children, emotions, and household – AND men – income generators, planners, handy-capable self-supporters.
With the end result that women are overextended. Expected to do too much, to be too many people, to carry too many oppositional goals, roles, responsibilities, and energies.
I hope I don’t irresponsibly speak for everyone when I state, “we’re burnt the fuck out.” We’re now men AND women, in traditional role terms, while men are… often… neither.
It is stressful. It is demanding. It is, in some ways, women-shaming.
And I don’t think the outcome is empowering for either party.
So in our modern era of allowing women to do anything – let’s also consider how they’re being instructed that they MUST do EVERYTHING. And the female counterpart (stereotypically men) are reiterating that’s the case, through their actions of generally shrinking away from the responsibilities that are now anticipated from ladies, so that the ladies have no choice but to step up to so many plates.
Has feminism helped?
In some ways.
Has it hurt?
Also, in some ways.
And the internet hasn’t quite figured out what the correct balance needs to be or how to provide instruction to achieve it. So that the toxic forms have persisted and propagated. Just in much prettier fonts and color combos than ever before.
And that makes it about time for us to:
WRAP
In conclusion, the internet has spread plenty of self-improvement information, including knowledge about dating better. However, the information has landed on the heads of women – suggesting or insisting that we “should” be able to use it to spare ourselves from all forms of heartbreak. Which, is impossible, is not our job, is fundamentally flawed based on the nature of covert abuse remaining hidden, and is antithetical to romance. If we’re always on the lookout, expecting the worst… when does the falling in love happen? And when we inevitably have a relationship challenge, when does the self-flagellation stop? For some of us the answer might be “never,” at which point we may give up on the whole idea and settle in to spinsterdom with an empowered attitude that hides the deep longing for emotional needs satiation underneath.
Second point, OR we might reject a life spent alone and take on the extra responsibility of becoming mental health and relationship professors to our potential romantic associates, in the effort to get them up to speed as viable partners. Which, unfortunately, tends to be slow and ongoing work. We women, stereotypically speaking, get educated on wellness and love issues. We know what we want and what isn’t considered healthy. And we then have the job of trying to impart that knowledge and behavioral skill, should we find a guy who’s not ringing those abuse bells. It creates an imbalanced, unsexy, frustrating dynamic in many cases. And generally detracts from the parts of an adult romantic relationship that one is searching for – like respite from the pressures of life and mutuality in what both people provide to each other.
We might also give up due to another form of social and personal judgment; comparing physical appearance to what we’re shown, everywhere. MAGA botox and filler, Ozempic waistlines, Kardashian BBLs and filters, Grande anorexia… how’s a girl supposed to keep up or come to terms with her own genetic provisions? She might pour time, attention, and money into the venture – trying to snatch up. She might present perfectly on the internet where appearance can be perfected by angles, lighting, and post-pic-edits – and feel ashamed or avoidant when it comes to showing up in real life. Or she might feel incapable of competing with what she assumes is “normal,” and give up entirely. Too much stress. Too much pressure. No chance of being as perfect as the new cultural, web-based, standards insist. A problem that is certainly split down income lines.
And, third point, because of the wealth, profession, and lifestyle disparity that dominates our modern society, we also have few “well balanced” men to choose from. In my experience, a good portion have forfeited against the forces of unstopping challenges – given up on trying to make something of themselves and “laid down” into video games, smoking, and generally acting more like children than self-sufficient adults. These men do not have the means or esteems to be compatible dating matches. The other large portion of dudes come from money and/or privilege, and have a hustle-culture mindset because their actions actually pay off. Everything they do is #blessed thanks in large part to the higher ground they started from. They, therefore, have busy, regimented, outward-success-driven lifestyles that are difficult to break into or become an important part of. They’re also, often, self-centered to a fault and have cute little god complexes from the illusions of always “winning.” Leaving a bitch with no viable matches for dates or promising relational partners for the long-term.
And lastly… we’ve been subjected to several forms of feminism that questionably assist women in a holistic way. Have feminists secured rights for us that we absolutely need, benefit from, and should defend with our lives? Yes. Thank god for the suffragettes and every other pro-woman-activist or supporter who has moved the needle for us. AND ALSO. Has feminism made the feminine more accepted or appreciated in society, broadly speaking? Absolutely not. It HAS allowed women to act more like men. Which has become more of a requirement than a privilege. Leaving women over-responsible and stretched too thin, instructed to be both (stereotypically speaking) men AND women… while men… seemingly don’t fulfill the roles of men OR women any longer. Broadly speaking. We just need to be everything for everyone, starting with ourselves. So that being in partnership is just as much work as being alone – or much more. And - see all above discussions; we might as well just be alone at that point. To be in relationship is like running a household alone, taking on children in the form of grownups, while we tend to the economic and emotional needs of everyone, often alone, but for a crowd.
Women have always faced enormous personal and societal challenges in dating. And these days, despite all the girl-empowered posts on Instagram, we might actually come up against more obstacles in dating and romance than ever. Because we seem to be exposed to more obstacles in living and self-actualizing, alone, than ever. And then we’re expected to make up for all the new and old shortcomings of men, since we’re autonomously empowered to, on top of it.
Which deserves, for each of us and collectively, a round of compassion.
So be kind to yourself. Acknowledge all that you face. Take as much off your shoulders as possible.
And good luck out there as you continue – femininely, in the purest sense of the word –
Dating. In. Dystopia.
And I’ll talk to you soon.